In Revelation 2:1-7 Jesus told a church that "HE" would remove their candlestick...if they would not return to their "1st" love.....A Candlestick can either be (in short) their angel or their messenger/ Pastor...He did NOT rebuke them for their "works" or "outreaches"...but HE said NONE of THAT matters....IF you LOSE your desire for the PASSIONATE embrace of the SPIRIT of GOD in your midst!!!!!
SADLY - I see that happening to a Church I know well RIGHT NOW!! Jesus - true to his Word has led their candlestick to leave.....it is truly sad when Jesus loses faith in a churches ability to continue in the "Spirit" and the "Truth" - many... people try to use nicy nicy words to explain this away...and it is amazing to me that "we" will allow one of our leaders to be cavalierly "sacrificed" on the "greater good of the church" concept - That's what I heard in the service....learn to listen...Remember - the sacrifice of Issac was a test of obedience that God relented from when his person/people acted rightly...God hates human sacrifice - He call it an abomination!
Yes, God will certainly re-assign the messenger/candlestick that was yours...but YOU as a church without corporately REPENTING will slowly (or not so slowly) but surely burn out through lack of anointing, and fizzle into the same now obvious obscurity that the Ephesus church did - never to be effectively heard from again....Congratulations - silent minority steering committee!!! - as the Proverbs say....enjoy falling into the pit you have made for the righteous... The "sharks" are driving the bus!!!
."Church" it's time to act!!! Act now and possibly keep your candlestick!! (See my note/message in "The Friends of Trinity Presbyterian Church West Sacramento Page") - Does God change His Mind?)
God does OFTEN change His mind - If you don't KNOW that - then you have been lied to (In church - it happens more often than you think!) and/or never read His book (See Jeremiah 18:7-11) If you will rally together and fulfill Trinity's mandate and mission as/after Steve sacrifices himself for YOU, why not rally together quickly and right now - AND ACT!!! possibly saving all that is good - God is merciful!! He forgave, sparred, relented, turned back - many many times in the Old testament - Steve will be placed somewhere else by God's grace (He will be fine) but why do you sit idly by and let Steve be your "sacrificial Lamb"
ALSO:
There is a lot of "noise" coming down the pike from leaders/people with NO SPIRITUAL SENSE about Grief and anger!!! BULL!!! (for the most part!!) The issue hear is: "A LITTLE LEAVEN LEAVENS THE WHOLE LUMP" Jesus' answer was to "Route out the leaven and become a holy lump" Paul used the word "purge" Some of your very leaders are using "psychology" (so called) to keep from addressing the "Real issue" -
One who tells lies (Ignorantly or on purpose) is NEVER your true Friend!
TAKING THE EASY ROAD NEVER BRINGS RESULTS THAT TRULY SATISFY...
Yesterday - Pastor Steve said (basically) after I'm gone, you people that are left - if you - want to do all that God has called this church to do - are going to have to band together and "make it known loudly" that YOU want to go forward - (this effectively means that by MAJORITY RULE you are proclaiming to the LEAVEN (Dissenters, and fearful, and grippers) that they need to get with the PROGRAM or they can "feel free to be "purged" out - but that you are going forward!!)
PASTOR STEVE is making it YOUR RESPONSIBILITY to PURGE OUT THE LEAVEN IN YOUR OWN CHURCH!!! - He said he could not AND cannot do it alone (and its making him appear like the enemy) and (BY HAVING TO DO IT ALONE - WITHOUT YOUR VOCAL SUPPORT) he cannot get the job done... So, God is moving him on to more EFFECTIVE ministry!!! WHAT A SHAME FOR OUR ELDERS AND SESSION TO BE SUCH POOR LISTENERS THAT THEY REFUSED TO HEAR WHAT WAS CLEARLY SAID!!! Either that, or they are ignorant (OBTUSE) enough to really think that with "another man" it will all happen "BUT IT WILL SOMEHOW BE EASIER" RUBBISH!!!
Change is always HARD and sometimes/most times BLOODY!!
IF you will do the leaven PURGING (By coming together as one0 AFTER he's gone - WHY NOT DO IT NOW!!!
P.S.
In Pastors Moses story/sermon - Moses did not go in to the Promised land - that is true - BUT - DON"T BE DECEIVED!!! - THAT ENTIRE GENERATION OF ISRAELITES DIED IN THE WILDERNESS "NEVER" TO SEE THE BLESSING PROMISED TO THEM BY GOD - THEY NEVER ENTERED IN!!!!
That original group of PEOPLE never saw God's best or True blessing and THEY WERE THE CHIEF CAUSE OF WEARING OUT MOSES TO FRUSTRATION AND FINALLY SIN -
They kept both THEMSELVES and MOSES from seeing the Promised Land....
Make no mistake - YOU cannot allow Steve to be sacrifices and EVER (in your generation) be blessed in God's fullness......
Listen carefully to the word of exhortation - listen carefully to what Pastor Steve really said, AND FIX THIS before your Candlestick is removed and your DESTINY Stopped cold!!
(REMEMBER, in the days of the prophets - one of the MAJOR themes was always that (1) prophet stood up and spoke a word that most did not want to hear and hoped wasn't the case, BUT there were ALWAYS MANY OTHER [God's choice of words - not mine] False prophets and poor leaders among the people (in great numbers by comparison) that were saying at the same time "ALL IS WELL" & "GOD GOD WILL BRING DELIVERANCE OUT OF THIS" they people had to choose WHO THEY WOULD TRUST IN - HOWEVER - no matter who they chose to "trust in" it DID NOT CHANGE THE TRUTH OR THE OUTCOME -
Selah
Monday, May 16, 2011
Does God Ever Repent or "Change His Mind"????
Can God Change His Mind?
I realize that this may sound funny – when I say that I have waited for a while to chime in on this on, as I have had much to say on my own personal Facebook page – but I have waited….Pastor Steve is my personal friend, and if he and Eleanor have prayed, sought God and heard from heaven that it is time for them to follow God into a new place – well... then, they have most certainly heard from God. However, that is or at least should NOT be the end of it for Trinity……
Let’s say, that one morning you get up and get ready for work, and as you are leaving the house, you fell a strong leading to NOT drive to work on your normal path. After some resistance, you finally concede and take a different route that day. When you get to work – on the news you see that there was a 30 car pile-up on the freeway (your normal route) at about the exact time you would have normally been there… YOU lift your hands and thank Jesus that he led you out of trouble! Les’s say people died and many were injured, and that the offending driver was drunk – does the fact that God led YOU out of trouble – in any way absolve the drunk driver from his responsibility in the crash. God saved you that day because you were obedient, but many others were hurt or killed and the problem still existed and still occurred.
What am I saying – to a great degree I agree with the upset gentleman – though God is leading Steve and his family out of trouble – that does not solve the issue except for Steve and the rest you are really listening and paying attention. The real question is WHY is God leading him away – is it simply for bigger and better things (They will come too) or is it to get him and his family out of harm’s way! Trinity needs to really look at the responsibly here…..
And to show this, let’s look at Jeremiah 18:7-11, “At what instant I shall speak concerning a nation, and concerning a kingdom, to pluck up, and to pull down, and to destroy it; If that nation, against whom I have pronounced, turn from their evil, I will repent of the evil that I thought to do unto them. And at what instant I shall speak concerning a nation, and concerning a kingdom, to build and to plant it; If it do evil in my sight, that it obey not my voice, then I will repent of the good, wherewith I said I would benefit them. Now therefore go to, speak to the men of Judah, and to the inhabitants of Jerusalem, saying, Thus saith the LORD; Behold, I frame evil against you, and devise a device against you: - return ye now every one from his evil way, and make your ways and your doings good. And they said, There is no hope: but we will walk after our own devices, and we will every one do the imagination of his evil heart.
My point is this – God is very plain here and a many other places in his Word- throughout the Bible, that – The first initial leading CAN BE CHANGED (and God really wants to change it back) IF the people realize that God really said it, BUT He said it to get them to turn from what they are doing wrong, repent, and get back on track again. Does Pastor Steve really have to leave? I don’t know, but this I know – he feels that he has become ineffective and unheard and discounted among those who want to do things other than what THEY want. This resistance has been mostly secret and very very fierce!!! Is he leaving because God spoke to him YES – Does he really have to go?? I BELIEVE THAT THE BIBLE TEACHES PLAINLY THAT “IF” TRINITY WILL PRAY AND SEARCH THEY”RE HEARTS and ASK and Plead for God’s will – THAT GOD MAY VERY VERY LIKELY do what is written in Jeremiah above and RE-SPEAK to Pastor and tell him, that the people are ready, willing and obedient to fulfill the great commission.
God told the prophet to tell King Hezekiah he was going to die – the king repented and God stopped the prophet halfway out of the palace and told him to go back for and tell him he had 15 more years. God later agreed to change His mind and will about Sodom and Gomorra, and saved Lot because Abraham kept on asking him to – God went to Abraham told him what he was going to do and then altered it 6 times!!! GOd stopped Abraham from sacrificing his only son - after He Himself had told him to do it!
SOMETIMES, many times, when God gives a word, it is so we can participate in changing, so God will not have to do what HE originally said!! Read that passage from Jeremiah again.
As to whether the present “elders’ in question are the problem – most likely not (But there is a unseen group that wants what THEY want so badly - that they are willing to push YOUR PASTOR OUT!!), BUT – I know that Pastor Steve is hoping and praying that after he is gone, that those who want to see the destiny of Trinity fulfilling the “great commission” will RALLY together, and that TOGETHER they will be able to PRAY and push through the silent/secret power plays that ARE going on in and around Trinity. He hopes that YOU working together WILL DO what he feels - with him there (under the current conditions) will not get done.
Did God speak to him – YES!!! BUT – CAN WE pray, repent, come together, and route out the dissention NOW!!! INSTEAD OF LATER – AFTER PASTOR STEVE IS GONE – AND IS THERE A STRONG BIBLICAL POSSIBLITY that GOD will CHANGE HIS mind and Re-set Steve as the called Pastor over TRINITY Presbyterian Church YES!!! YES!! YES!!
How about it church – if we are eventually going to get together, put down our petty differences and agendas – while wait until Steve and Eleanor are gone??? Let’s pray NOW, Let’s search our hearts NOW, LET’S STAND UNITED IN PURPOSE WITH AND FOR STEVE NOW – According to Jeremiah 18:7-11 – God often wants to relent from his “set” course and change His expressed will (Read it above)
If you will finally come together, pray, work and put aside yourselves to fulfill the great commission of Trinity – I say – do not wait for later - Let’s do it now and ask God to “re-speak to Steve and Eleanor!! God can’t be bluffed – so it’s going take some real prayer work and standing together as one against the enemies of Trinity – both in the Spirit and in the PEW! – But, though God can’t be bought – He does delight to change His mind and will in love.
I realize that this may sound funny – when I say that I have waited for a while to chime in on this on, as I have had much to say on my own personal Facebook page – but I have waited….Pastor Steve is my personal friend, and if he and Eleanor have prayed, sought God and heard from heaven that it is time for them to follow God into a new place – well... then, they have most certainly heard from God. However, that is or at least should NOT be the end of it for Trinity……
Let’s say, that one morning you get up and get ready for work, and as you are leaving the house, you fell a strong leading to NOT drive to work on your normal path. After some resistance, you finally concede and take a different route that day. When you get to work – on the news you see that there was a 30 car pile-up on the freeway (your normal route) at about the exact time you would have normally been there… YOU lift your hands and thank Jesus that he led you out of trouble! Les’s say people died and many were injured, and that the offending driver was drunk – does the fact that God led YOU out of trouble – in any way absolve the drunk driver from his responsibility in the crash. God saved you that day because you were obedient, but many others were hurt or killed and the problem still existed and still occurred.
What am I saying – to a great degree I agree with the upset gentleman – though God is leading Steve and his family out of trouble – that does not solve the issue except for Steve and the rest you are really listening and paying attention. The real question is WHY is God leading him away – is it simply for bigger and better things (They will come too) or is it to get him and his family out of harm’s way! Trinity needs to really look at the responsibly here…..
And to show this, let’s look at Jeremiah 18:7-11, “At what instant I shall speak concerning a nation, and concerning a kingdom, to pluck up, and to pull down, and to destroy it; If that nation, against whom I have pronounced, turn from their evil, I will repent of the evil that I thought to do unto them. And at what instant I shall speak concerning a nation, and concerning a kingdom, to build and to plant it; If it do evil in my sight, that it obey not my voice, then I will repent of the good, wherewith I said I would benefit them. Now therefore go to, speak to the men of Judah, and to the inhabitants of Jerusalem, saying, Thus saith the LORD; Behold, I frame evil against you, and devise a device against you: - return ye now every one from his evil way, and make your ways and your doings good. And they said, There is no hope: but we will walk after our own devices, and we will every one do the imagination of his evil heart.
My point is this – God is very plain here and a many other places in his Word- throughout the Bible, that – The first initial leading CAN BE CHANGED (and God really wants to change it back) IF the people realize that God really said it, BUT He said it to get them to turn from what they are doing wrong, repent, and get back on track again. Does Pastor Steve really have to leave? I don’t know, but this I know – he feels that he has become ineffective and unheard and discounted among those who want to do things other than what THEY want. This resistance has been mostly secret and very very fierce!!! Is he leaving because God spoke to him YES – Does he really have to go?? I BELIEVE THAT THE BIBLE TEACHES PLAINLY THAT “IF” TRINITY WILL PRAY AND SEARCH THEY”RE HEARTS and ASK and Plead for God’s will – THAT GOD MAY VERY VERY LIKELY do what is written in Jeremiah above and RE-SPEAK to Pastor and tell him, that the people are ready, willing and obedient to fulfill the great commission.
God told the prophet to tell King Hezekiah he was going to die – the king repented and God stopped the prophet halfway out of the palace and told him to go back for and tell him he had 15 more years. God later agreed to change His mind and will about Sodom and Gomorra, and saved Lot because Abraham kept on asking him to – God went to Abraham told him what he was going to do and then altered it 6 times!!! GOd stopped Abraham from sacrificing his only son - after He Himself had told him to do it!
SOMETIMES, many times, when God gives a word, it is so we can participate in changing, so God will not have to do what HE originally said!! Read that passage from Jeremiah again.
As to whether the present “elders’ in question are the problem – most likely not (But there is a unseen group that wants what THEY want so badly - that they are willing to push YOUR PASTOR OUT!!), BUT – I know that Pastor Steve is hoping and praying that after he is gone, that those who want to see the destiny of Trinity fulfilling the “great commission” will RALLY together, and that TOGETHER they will be able to PRAY and push through the silent/secret power plays that ARE going on in and around Trinity. He hopes that YOU working together WILL DO what he feels - with him there (under the current conditions) will not get done.
Did God speak to him – YES!!! BUT – CAN WE pray, repent, come together, and route out the dissention NOW!!! INSTEAD OF LATER – AFTER PASTOR STEVE IS GONE – AND IS THERE A STRONG BIBLICAL POSSIBLITY that GOD will CHANGE HIS mind and Re-set Steve as the called Pastor over TRINITY Presbyterian Church YES!!! YES!! YES!!
How about it church – if we are eventually going to get together, put down our petty differences and agendas – while wait until Steve and Eleanor are gone??? Let’s pray NOW, Let’s search our hearts NOW, LET’S STAND UNITED IN PURPOSE WITH AND FOR STEVE NOW – According to Jeremiah 18:7-11 – God often wants to relent from his “set” course and change His expressed will (Read it above)
If you will finally come together, pray, work and put aside yourselves to fulfill the great commission of Trinity – I say – do not wait for later - Let’s do it now and ask God to “re-speak to Steve and Eleanor!! God can’t be bluffed – so it’s going take some real prayer work and standing together as one against the enemies of Trinity – both in the Spirit and in the PEW! – But, though God can’t be bought – He does delight to change His mind and will in love.
Subscribe to:
Posts (Atom)