Trinity Presbyterian - Does He Remove Pastors Today? & Why?"

In Revelation 2:1-7 Jesus told a church that "HE" would remove their candlestick...if they would not return to their "1st" love.....A Candlestick can either be (in short) their angel or their messenger/ Pastor...He did NOT rebuke them for their "works" or "outreaches"...but HE said NONE of THAT matters....IF you LOSE your desire for the PASSIONATE embrace of the SPIRIT of GOD in your midst!!!!!

SADLY - I see that happening to a Church I know well RIGHT NOW!! Jesus - true to his Word has led their candlestick to leave.....it is truly sad when Jesus loses faith in a churches ability to continue in the "Spirit" and the "Truth" - many... people try to use nicy nicy words to explain this away...and it is amazing to me that "we" will allow one of our leaders to be cavalierly "sacrificed" on the "greater good of the church" concept - That's what I heard in the service....learn to listen...Remember - the sacrifice of  Issac was a test of obedience that God relented from when his person/people acted rightly...God hates human sacrifice - He call it an abomination!

Yes, God will certainly re-assign the messenger/candlestick that was yours...but YOU as a church without corporately REPENTING will  slowly (or not so slowly) but surely burn out through lack of anointing, and fizzle into the same now obvious obscurity that the Ephesus church did - never to be effectively heard from again....Congratulations - silent minority steering committee!!! - as the Proverbs say....enjoy falling into the pit you have made for the righteous... The "sharks" are driving the bus!!!

‎."Church" it's time to act!!! Act now and possibly keep your candlestick!! (See my note/message in "The Friends of Trinity Presbyterian Church West Sacramento Page") - Does God change His Mind?)

God does OFTEN change His mind - If you don't KNOW that - then you have been lied to (In church - it happens more often than you think!) and/or never read His book (See Jeremiah 18:7-11) If you will rally together and fulfill Trinity's mandate and mission as/after Steve sacrifices himself for YOU, why not rally together quickly and right now - AND ACT!!! possibly saving all that is good - God is merciful!! He forgave, sparred, relented, turned back - many many times in the Old testament - Steve will be placed somewhere else by God's grace (He will be fine) but why do you sit idly by and let Steve be your "sacrificial Lamb"

 ALSO:

There is a lot of "noise" coming down the pike from leaders/people with NO SPIRITUAL SENSE about Grief and anger!!! BULL!!! (for the most part!!)  The issue hear is: "A LITTLE LEAVEN LEAVENS THE WHOLE LUMP" Jesus' answer was to "Route out the leaven and become a holy lump" Paul used the word "purge" Some of your very leaders are using "psychology" (so called) to keep from addressing the "Real issue" -

One who tells lies (Ignorantly or on purpose) is NEVER your true Friend!

TAKING THE EASY ROAD NEVER BRINGS RESULTS THAT TRULY SATISFY...

Yesterday - Pastor Steve said (basically) after I'm gone, you people that are left - if you - want to do all that God has called this church to do - are going to have to band together and "make it known loudly" that YOU want to go forward - (this effectively means that by MAJORITY RULE you are proclaiming to the LEAVEN (Dissenters, and fearful, and grippers) that they need to get with the PROGRAM or they can "feel free to be "purged" out - but that you are going forward!!) 

PASTOR STEVE is making it YOUR RESPONSIBILITY to PURGE OUT THE LEAVEN IN YOUR OWN CHURCH!!! - He said he  could not AND cannot do it alone (and its making him appear like the enemy) and (BY HAVING TO DO IT ALONE - WITHOUT YOUR VOCAL SUPPORT) he cannot get the job done... So, God is moving him on to more EFFECTIVE ministry!!! WHAT A SHAME FOR OUR ELDERS AND SESSION TO BE SUCH POOR LISTENERS THAT THEY REFUSED TO HEAR WHAT WAS CLEARLY SAID!!!  Either that, or they are ignorant (OBTUSE)  enough to really think that with "another man" it will all happen "BUT IT WILL SOMEHOW BE EASIER"  RUBBISH!!!

Change is always HARD and sometimes/most times BLOODY!!

IF you will do the leaven PURGING (By coming together as one0 AFTER he's gone - WHY NOT DO IT NOW!!!

P.S.

In Pastors Moses story/sermon - Moses did not go in to the Promised land - that is true - BUT  - DON"T  BE DECEIVED!!! - THAT ENTIRE GENERATION OF ISRAELITES DIED IN THE WILDERNESS "NEVER" TO SEE THE BLESSING PROMISED TO THEM BY GOD - THEY NEVER ENTERED IN!!!!

That original group of  PEOPLE never saw God's best or True blessing and THEY WERE THE CHIEF CAUSE OF WEARING OUT MOSES TO FRUSTRATION AND FINALLY SIN -

They kept both THEMSELVES and MOSES from seeing the Promised Land....

Make no mistake - YOU cannot allow Steve to be sacrifices and EVER (in your generation) be blessed in God's fullness......

Listen carefully to the word of exhortation - listen carefully to what Pastor Steve really said,  AND FIX THIS  before your Candlestick is removed and your DESTINY  Stopped cold!!

(REMEMBER, in the days of the prophets - one of the MAJOR themes was always that (1) prophet stood up and spoke a word that most did not want to hear and hoped wasn't the case, BUT there were ALWAYS MANY OTHER [God's choice of words - not mine] False prophets and poor leaders among the people  (in great numbers by comparison) that were saying at the same time "ALL IS WELL"  & "GOD GOD WILL BRING DELIVERANCE OUT OF THIS"  they people had to choose WHO THEY WOULD TRUST IN - HOWEVER - no matter who they chose to "trust in" it DID NOT CHANGE THE TRUTH OR THE OUTCOME -

Selah

Does God Ever Repent or "Change His Mind"????

Can God Change His Mind?

I realize that this may sound funny – when I say that I have waited for a while to chime in on this on, as I have had much to say on my own personal Facebook page – but I have waited….Pastor Steve is my personal friend, and if he and Eleanor have prayed, sought God and heard from heaven that it is time for them to follow God into a new place – well... then, they have most certainly heard from God. However, that is or at least should NOT be the end of it for Trinity……

Let’s say, that one morning you get up and get ready for work, and as you are leaving the house, you fell a strong leading to NOT drive to work on your normal path.  After some resistance, you finally concede and take a different route that day.  When you get to work – on the news you see that there was a 30 car pile-up on the freeway (your normal route) at about the exact time you would have normally been there… YOU lift your hands and thank Jesus that he led you out of trouble! Les’s say people died and many were injured, and that the offending driver was drunk – does the fact that God led YOU out of trouble – in any way absolve the drunk driver from his responsibility in the crash. God saved you that day because you were obedient, but many others were hurt or killed and the problem still existed and still occurred.

What am I saying – to a great degree I agree with the upset gentleman – though God is leading Steve and his family out of trouble – that does not solve the issue except for Steve and the rest you are really listening and paying attention. The real question is WHY is God leading him away – is it simply for bigger and better things (They will come too) or is it to get him and his family out of harm’s way! Trinity needs to really look at the responsibly here…..

And to show this, let’s look at Jeremiah 18:7-11, “At what instant I shall speak concerning a nation, and concerning a kingdom, to pluck up, and to pull down, and to destroy it; If that nation, against whom I have pronounced, turn from their evil, I will repent of the evil that I thought to do unto them.  And at what instant I shall speak concerning a nation, and concerning a kingdom, to build and to plant it; If it do evil in my sight, that it obey not my voice, then I will repent of the good, wherewith I said I would benefit them.  Now therefore go to, speak to the men of Judah, and to the inhabitants of Jerusalem, saying, Thus saith the LORD; Behold, I frame evil against you, and devise a device against you: -  return ye now every one from his evil way, and make your ways and your doings good.  And they said, There is no hope: but we will walk after our own devices, and we will every one do the imagination of his evil heart.

My point is this – God is very plain here and a many other places in his Word- throughout the Bible, that – The first initial leading CAN BE CHANGED (and God really wants to change it back) IF the people realize that God really said it, BUT He said it to get them to turn from what they are doing wrong, repent, and get back on track again. Does Pastor Steve really have to leave?  I don’t know, but this I know – he feels that he has become ineffective and unheard and discounted among those who want to do things other than what THEY want.  This resistance has been mostly secret and very very fierce!!!  Is he leaving because God spoke to him YES – Does he really have to go??  I BELIEVE THAT THE BIBLE TEACHES PLAINLY THAT “IF” TRINITY WILL PRAY AND SEARCH THEY”RE HEARTS and ASK and Plead for God’s will – THAT GOD MAY VERY VERY LIKELY  do what is written in Jeremiah above and RE-SPEAK to Pastor and tell him, that the people are ready, willing and obedient to fulfill the great commission.

God told the prophet to tell King Hezekiah he was going to die – the king repented and God stopped the prophet halfway out of the palace and told him to go back for and tell him he had 15 more years.  God later agreed to change His mind and will about Sodom and Gomorra, and saved Lot because Abraham kept on asking him to – God went to Abraham told him what he was going to do and then altered it 6 times!!!  GOd stopped Abraham from sacrificing his only son - after He Himself had told him to do it!

SOMETIMES, many times, when God gives a word, it is so we can participate in changing, so God will not have to do what HE originally said!!  Read that passage from Jeremiah again.

As to whether the present “elders’ in question are the problem – most likely not (But there is a  unseen group that wants what THEY want so badly - that they are willing to push YOUR PASTOR OUT!!),  BUT – I know that Pastor Steve is hoping and praying that after he is gone, that those who want to see the destiny of Trinity fulfilling the “great commission” will RALLY together, and that TOGETHER they will be able to PRAY and push through the silent/secret power plays that ARE going on in and around Trinity. He hopes that YOU working together WILL DO what he feels  - with him there (under the current conditions) will not get done.
Did God speak to him – YES!!! BUT – CAN WE pray, repent, come together, and route out the dissention NOW!!! INSTEAD OF LATER – AFTER PASTOR STEVE IS GONE – AND IS THERE A STRONG BIBLICAL POSSIBLITY that GOD will CHANGE HIS mind and Re-set Steve as the called Pastor over TRINITY Presbyterian Church YES!!! YES!! YES!!

How about it church – if we are eventually going to get together, put down our petty differences and agendas – while wait until Steve and Eleanor are gone???  Let’s pray NOW, Let’s search our hearts NOW, LET’S STAND UNITED IN PURPOSE WITH AND FOR STEVE NOW – According to Jeremiah 18:7-11 – God often wants to relent from his “set” course and change His expressed will (Read it above)

If you will finally come together, pray, work and put aside yourselves to fulfill the great commission of Trinity – I say – do not wait for later - Let’s do it now and ask God to “re-speak to Steve and Eleanor!!  God can’t be bluffed – so it’s going take some real prayer work and standing together as one against the enemies of Trinity – both in the Spirit and in the PEW! – But, though God can’t be bought – He does delight to change His mind and will in love.

Chapter 4 - I'm Filled with the Holy Spirit, But I Don't Speak in Tongues? - Sorry, Wrong Answer!!

Chapter 4

This is going to be a somewhat difficult chapter, for it will be dedicated to the overcoming of several long-held objections that “speaking in tongues” is not a necessary component of being filled with the spirit, as many churches teach it today.

There are many pastors and teachers in the body of Christ today that either wrongly believe, or a been taught, to use 1 Corinthians 12:29 – 30 as the one of the chief arguments against the idea plainly taught elsewhere in the Bible -  that it is the “expressed will of God”, that ALL believers in Christ Jesus should go on from their initial salvation experience to experience a second experience in the Holy Spirit, known by several names, but most commonly as “being filled with the Spirit." And, that the initial “external physical evidence” of receiving that baptism in the Holy Spirit (if it is to follow the biblical model and be along scriptural lines) must be one several, or all of the scriptural evidences for receiving the baptism in the spirit – those being "speaking in tongues," glorifying God, or prophesying. These are the only three actual scriptural evidences or “signs” listed, that were present when the Christians in the book of Acts received the Holy Spirit.

Please notice that I did NOT say, that speaking in tongues was the Holy Spirit, only that it was the main proof or “physical evidence” (external sign, present at the time – validating the legitimacy, and/or receipt, or completion of the infilling).  Though “speaking with other tongues” is an important gift that NO BELEIVER should be without, we do not primarily seek to speak in tongues as much as we desire “the giver of Spiritual gifts Himself – and that is the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit is more important than “tongues,” however, nowhere in the Bible does it say we have to “choose” between the two.  In fact, the “external evidence” or “sign” that you have actually received the genuine Holy Spirit,  and received it in the measure and the way that the Bible prescribes, is that  “You know, when you HEAR IT – that you have it!” 

Actually, though “tongues” is the “initial” outward sign or biblical evidence of your “infilling; FAITH, is your initial “internal” evidence. Hebrews 11:1 says, “Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, and the [evidence] of things not seen.”  Now we know that “faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.”(Romans 10:17)  So where is a promise from the word of God that we can base my faith on - that God the Father will DEFINITELY fill me with the Holy Spirit, if I ask Him to?  Luke 11:13, “If you then, being evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to those who ask Him!”  Right there is a great promise to hang your faith on!  More on the specifics of “how to receive” this gift (Along with tongues) in a later chapter…

Back to or original question.  When Paul says in 1 Corinthians 12:30, "do all have gifts of healings? Do all speak with tongues? Do all interpret?" he is not speaking about or referencing the “other tongues” that the individual believer receives at the “baptism of the Holy Spirit” – He is speaking of something altogether different!   Many have tried to take this, and make this mean that Paul was saying, that not everybody does or should speak in an unknown tongue, or speak with tongues; and that is absolutely not what Paul was talking about! You will notice in the list found in verses 29-30, that every question listed, is about an “office of ministry;” not necessarily just a fivefold ministry office, like the apostle, the pastor, and evangelist, etc., but also other offices of ministry in the church, specifically those that might take place during a church service – more on that in a minute.

In the context of verse 29, Paul lists apostles, prophets, teachers, and workers of miracles (or the evangelist). Everything listed in verse 29, is a “5-fold” ministry gift, or an office gift, given by Jesus to the church, and listed in Ephesians 4:11. In verse 30, Paul lists “gifts of healings”, “tongues,” and “the interpretation of tongues” – all of which are listed in 1 Corinthians 12:8-10 as gifts given to individuals - but these “gifts” were given to them - to profit the entire body of Christ (when gathered in their individual churches). This is not the individual and personal prayer language given to the believer when they are baptized in the Holy Spirit.  In other places in 1 Corinthians, Paul refers to this personal baptism gift as an “unknown tongues” or “other tongues”. But given the context of the rest of verse 30, “gifts of healings,” and the “interpretation of tongues,” - Paul is making a distinction between "the unknown or other  tongues” given to the individual believer" and "different kinds of tongues" given to the church for the public church gathering -  listed in 1 Corinthians 12:10.  Verse 10, lists, among the nine gifts of the spirit; “gifts of healings” (v.9) and “different kinds of tongues,” and the “interpretation of those tongues” (v.10.)

This is a very important distinction; there is a "speaking in other tongues" given to, or at least available to, every believer in Christ Jesus who will receive it through the "infilling of the Holy Spirit," but there is also a “gift of the Spirit,” known as "different kinds of tongues" which Paul says, must be interpreted. Given the context of the list of offices and public church gathering gifts – gifts of the Spirit "ministries" or "functions" mentioned in 1 Corinthians 12:29 – 30, it becomes apparent that this is the kind of “tongues” that Paul is talking about, and also, that he considers “different kind of tongues” and the interpretation of those tongues to be a ministry gift given to the church expressly for the public church gathering setting.   In almost all of chapter 14, of 1 Corinthians, Paul goes into great detail about how and when these two gifts – working together as a team – are to be used inside a church service in the body of Christ.

Another thing that I would like to bring to light, is 1 Corinthians 12: 4 - 7, "there are diversities of gifts, but the same spirit. There are differences of ministries but the same Lord. And there are diversities of activities but it is the same God who works all in all. But the manifestation of the spirit is given to each one for the profit of all." Many leaders today, especially some of the more mainstream, evangelical churches (but also sadly, in many of what used to be Charismatic, Pentecostal, and Full Gospel churches as well) appear to be teaching, either ignorantly or on purpose, that there is no difference in the gifts listed in Ephesians chapter 4, the gifts listed in one Corinthians 12, the gifts listed in Romans 12, but that they are all “gifts of the Spirit.” There most certainly are differences! Huge differences!

1 Corinthians 12:4 - 6 is not simply “restating the same thing three times,” but Paul is making three separate distinctions, and three different categories of gifts: the gifts of the Spirit, the ministry gifts – given by Jesus, and the different operations gifts, or what some term as "the motivational gifts" given by God the Father. Three distinct categories of gifts, each from a different giver, each with a different purpose, and within each one of these, a unique operation, as it flows through the human vessel that God put the gifts in.

But notice in verse 7, that Paul is going back to his original subject – the “gifts” or manifestations of the Spirit; and he says, "but the manifestation of the Spirit is given to each one for the profit of all." These manifestations or gifts of the Spirit are given by the Holy Spirit to the individual believer - for the mutual benefit of everyone in the body of Christ. These gifts of the Spirit are given to the church for public ministry. Public ministry! Many church leaders today have declared from their pulpits and taught in their churches, that the general term "decently and in order" means that there should be no public manifestation of any of the gifts of the Spirit – no prophesy – no tongues with interpretation – no gifts of the spirit in public at any time!

But how can this be right, because Paul spends the entirety of chapter 14 describing in detail - examples of the gifts of the Spirit in operation in a public or gathered church service. He even goes on to make a distinction between the “simple gift of prophecy,” (V.3) and the office of the prophet (v.29,30), stating that if a prophet (that being the office of a Prophet, and not just one in the church who is used by the Spirit to "prophesy" from time to time – but the ministry gift of a Prophet - which may and most likely will prophesy with regularity, but actually, one who is a Prophet in “office” or ministry gift, will most likely be a preacher, and give what God gives him, not only in the gift of prophecy, but through messages preached to the church -  much like a pastor would preach to his people.) 

How would many pastors feel today, if a prophet stood up, much like Paul describes in 1 Corinthians 14:29,  and politely interrupted the current speaker, and asked to be given the floor? Provided that he is “in fact” a prophet, Paul also declares this action to be "decently and in order." How many pastors and churches are willing to make “space” in their “order of service” for theses kinds of manifestations? But the New Testament plainly describes this type of service as both “Decent and in order!”

Again you will notice, in 1 Corinthians 14:26, that Paul says, "how is it then, brethren? Whenever you come together each one of you has a Psalm, has a teaching, has a tongue, has a revelation, has an interpretation. Let all things be done for edification." Paul tells when these things will happen – he says "when you come together." Paul also lists the things that should happen and declares them to be okay. He lists among other things: a tongue, and interpretation, and a revelation (the Prophets ministry in operation), and he expressly says, "let all things be done for edification." That is just one example of what the Bible declares to be "decently and in order." Given this clear example from Scripture, how far have we the church fallen away from the model given to us in Scripture of what a typical church service could and should look like.

 We have brought all this material into the light of day, simply to magnify the fact that when Paul says, “do all speak with tongues, do all interpret?” – he was talking about the gifts of the Spirit - that might be in operation during any given church service or gathering – through the individual members of the body – and for each other.

Notice again that 1 Corinthians 12:10 says,"different kinds of tongues." This means definitely that there is more than one kind of tongues. Paul speaks of “unknown” or other tongues, and Paul speaks of “different kinds of tongues.” We have learned that “different kinds of tongues” is a gift of the Spirit to be used in public ministry - when the gift of interpretation is also present. But other tongues, or what Paul calls unknown tongues are the “tongues” that are given to each believer, who will receive them, at the point where they are filled or baptized with the Holy Spirit. Again Paul says, "I speak with tongues more than the all."

The epistle of Jude makes reference to this in verse 20 – 21, "but you, beloved, building yourselves up on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Spirit, keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life." According to Jude verse 1, Jude is speaking to "those who are called, sanctified by God the Father, and preserved in Jesus Christ." Jude is speaking to the entire body of Christ, and in these few verses, where Jude pours out his admonitions and warnings to the body of Christ, one of his clearest exhortations to them (and to us) is that he tells them to keep themselves built up by "praying in the Holy Spirit." If this verse was all we had, one might be able to assume just about anything from it, and many might simply assume that praying in the spirit is just simply “a heartfelt prayer in our native language.” But this is simply not the case!

The Bible has not left us alone with Jude verse 20. Back in 1 Corinthians 14:4, Paul says, "he who speaks in a tongue edifies himself, but he who prophesies edifies the church.”  Paul says here that it he who prays in a tongue (or unknown tongues) “edifies” himself. The word “edify” means to “build up” in Greek. Paul and Jude are talking about the same thing – praying in the Holy Spirit is praying in an unknown tongue, and it “builds you up!”  I don’t know about you – but I could sure use some “Being built up” on a regular basis…  No wonder the devil fights “tongues” so fiercely – he wants to keep the Christian and the church weak and mostly powerless!  More on that later….

In Romans 8:26 we find this familiar verse, "likewise the Spirit also helps our weaknesses, for we do not know what we should pray for as we ought, but the Spirit Himself maketh intercession for us with groanings that cannot be uttered." Paul says here that there are times when we ourselves don't know what we are to pray for, and that in those times, that the Holy Spirit Himself prays for us (or through us) with groanings that cannot be uttered. The Amplified Version of the Bible for this verse says, "but the Spirit Himself goes to meet our supplication and pleads in our behalf with unspeakable yearnings and groanings to deep for utterance.”

Again, if this verse was all by itself, we might be able to make of it whatever we chose, but when we compare it with  I Corinthians 14:2, "for he who speaks in a tongue does not speak to men but to God, for no one understands him, however in the spirit he speaks mysteries." And again with verse 14, "for if I pray in a tongue my spirit prays, but my understanding is unfruitful." When the verses of Jude, Romans, and 1 Corinthians are all taken together, it becomes very plain that the “groanings” and things difficult to be uttered, of Romans 8:26 are the unknown tongues that God gives us to speak directly through the Spirit (Or with the Spirit’s help) out beyond our understanding (1 Cor. 14:14) and directly to God Himself (I Cor. 14:2) in our greatest times of need. Paul apparently, so enjoyed his ability to use this gift of God given to him at his baptism in the Holy Spirit, that he proudly proclaimed, "I thank my God I speak with tongues more than you all."

So and quick summation, there is a distinction in the New Testament between what is commonly called the gift of the Spirit for the church, known as "different kinds of tongues" and "other tongues" which are available to every believer who will receive them as a gift from the Holy Spirit given to them, that they might have a prayer language which allows them to always pray in the perfect will of God, even when they do not know what they should pray for as they should.

The second item I would like to deal with in this chapter, is the idea that some Christians have been told that these gifts of the Spirit, and specifically speaking with tongues have passed away from the church, with the last of the original apostles, and that they were given to the early church only, until the church was established, and then their time was over. This idea is somewhat more difficult to overcome, not because the Scripture is not very clear on the issue, but because the people that purport this idea to their congregations - have no solid scriptural basis for making this claim. Therefore, it is hard to fight a completely non-scriptural argument with Scripture, if the person you're discussing it with, is not willing to accept the authority of Scripture alone.

If you have been told this "theory" about the passing away of the gifts of the Spirit and “speaking in tongues,” then I simply ask you to keep an open mind, and let the Scriptures themselves convince you that the Holy Spirit has given gifts to the church as well as to the believer, and His gifts to the church and to the individual believer have never passed away, and will never pass away as long as there are believers in the church.

To see this clearly, we will look again at one Scripture we have already studied from the book of Acts, chapter 2. On the day of Pentecost after the believers in the upper room were filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak in tongues as the Spirit gave them utterance, the crowd outside asked was going on. At the end of Peter's explanation to the crowd, and his preaching of the gospel to them, he plainly states about this form of  Holy Spirit baptism (He refers to it as the promise of the Father) in verse 39, "for the promise is to you and to your children, and to all who are afar off, as many as the Lord our God will call." He says that both salvation and the baptism of the Holy Spirit (v.38) are for all, and, "as many as the Lord shall call."

Let's look briefly at Deuteronomy 29:29, "the secret things belong to the Lord our God, but those things which are revealed belong to us and to our children forever, that we may do all the words of this law." Here the Bible says that God’s  secrets belong to Him alone, but anything that He has ever revealed to the sons of men, becomes ours in perpetuity, from that time on,  extending on into forever. But you say, “that's in the Old Testament, that promise has nothing to do with the church today.”  I beg to differ!

2 Corinthians 1:20, "for all the promises of God in Him are yes, and in him Amen, to the glory of God through us." Paul declares the same thing in 2 Corinthians that is stated in Deuteronomy 29; every promise that God has ever made stands available to us today, and the answer to our prayer (When based upon God’s written promise) is always yes. If God ever promised it, then it is available today, and the answer is yes!

One last verse, which will be the “capstone” in this argument as to whether or not things in the early church have “passed away,” and are no longer available to the church today:   Hebrews 13:8, "Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever." Even though it is not part of our text, it is worthy to note that the very next verse in Hebrews 13, starts out by saying "do not be carried about with various and strange doctrines..." It's almost like the writer of Hebrews was saying - Jesus will always be just the same as He is in the Bible, SO, don't be easily moved into some new doctrine – like after the church was fully established tongues and all the gifts of the spirit passed away. I say with all the gentleness of my heart, the “passing away” doctrine is man-made – rubbish!!

Every gift that Jesus, the Father, or the Holy Spirit  has ever given to the church, was never taken back, nor did it ever pass away. Romans 11:29, speaking about gifts of God, and the fact that they never pass away or are ever taken back by God, says, "for the gifts and calling of God are irrevocable.” Notice it says “Gifts” as well as callings!  That should just about settle it - if God ever gave it, He will never take it back or revoke it – Jesus is the same yesterday, today, and forever. Amen!

So in summary of where we are thus far in our study:  1.) when you receive Jesus as Savior and Lord, you are born of the spirit, but both Jesus and the apostles taught a second experience, commonly referred to in the Bible as "being filled with the spirit" or "being baptized in the Holy Spirit." 2.), in the book of Acts, every time a group of people or individual was “filled” with the Holy Spirit, the SINGLE common thread of each of those events was that the people "spoke with tongues." 3.) we have made a distinction between the “gift of the Spirit” given for public ministry -  that operates in tandem with "interpretation of tongues," which is called "different kinds of tongues," which is distinct from that which is referred to in the book of Acts as "speaking with other tongues." The first, being, expressly for public ministry, and the edification of all believers, and the second, being, a personal prayer language given to us by the Holy Spirit to aid us personally in prayer and spiritual growth. And 4.), hopefully we have been able to show -  based upon the authority of God's written Word,  that any promise that God has ever made, or revealed to his people, is still in force, and the answer is YES to us today through Christ Jesus.  And also, that the infilling of the Holy Spirit is just such a promise, and as such, never changes in its nature or character, and never passes away, so as long as there is still a  church with believers in it left on planet Earth. 

The “infilling of the Holy Spirit, with the biblical “external” evidence of “speaking in other tongues” is just as real and available today, as it ever was, AND according to Acts 2:39, the infilling of the Holy Spirit and speaking with tongues is available right now to ALL believers - …”to all who are still far off, as many as the Lord shall call.” My friend, if you have been called into salvation through Jesus Christ, then you are just as surely "called" to receive the “baptism of the Holy Spirit,” and just as “called” to receive the gift of your heavenly prayer language, or “speaking with other tongues”  If Jesus saved you, He has called you to receive the rest of these gifts as well. Will you open your heart to receive this “gift” from the Father God Himself?  (See John 14:16)

Oh boy, now on to the really good stuff!  In the next chapter, we begin to talk about all the  reasons for “speaking in tongues” and all the great and powerful blessings and victories that it can and will bring into your life, “IF” You Will “Let”  “the Spirit give you utterance.” (Acts 2:4)

Chapter 3 - I'm Filled the Holy Spirit, But I Don't Speak in Tongues - Don't Bug Me!

Chapter 3

Up to this point we have simply been laying the groundwork that every person who receives Jesus Christ as Lord, and is born again or “born of the spirit” has the Holy Spirit inside them at the point of salvation or conversion.  It is important that you see that, because many people can get confused or offended when we begin to speak of the need for a secondary Holy Spirit experience. So, if you are born again, you indeed have the Holy Spirit living inside of you. Secondarily, as we have also shown in the previous chapters, both Jesus and the apostles, in multiple places in the bible, both encouraged and taught everyone who was a believer to go on to the secondary experience known as being, "baptized in the Spirit."

You may say then, “why, if I all ready have the spirit inside of me, do I need to be baptized in the Spirit? Isn't having the Holy Spirit enough?” My answer to that is, apparently not – at least according to Jesus!  Because Jesus and the apostles plainly taught that we needed to go on from our salvation experience, to another experience – a second experience with the Holy Spirit.

I do have some idea as to “why” this is the case, which I will go into in some depth in a later chapter, but for now, let it be enough, that this second experience is the simple and direct commandment Jesus to us, after we become Christians or are “born again.”.

So what is this secondary experience called “the baptism of the Holy Spirit?”  How do we get it, and how will we know when we have received it? These are all very good questions; let's look into the word of God again, and see if the Bible answers these questions plainly and simply for us.

Let's go again to Acts chapter 2 verse 4, which is the very first outpouring of the Holy Spirit upon the church, separate from when they received the Holy Spirit directly from Jesus - when he “breathed on them” in John chapter 20. Acts 2:4 says, "and they were all filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance." We can see from this, that when the Holy Spirit was first poured out upon the disciples (as distinct from their salvation experience) on the day of Pentecost, that “they spoke with other tongues as the Spirit gave them utterance." Speaking in other tongues was at least, the very first “initial sign” of this secondary Holy Spirit experience.

In verse 14 of the same chapter, Peter stood up and addressed the large crowd of Jews that was also present there, who were wondering about this "speaking in tongues." In verse 16 he says to them, "but this is what was spoken by the prophet Joel: and it shall come to pass in the last days says God, I will pour out my Spirit on all flesh; your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, your young men shall see visions, your old men shall dream dreams and upon my menservants and on my maidservants I will pour out my spirit in those days." Notice Peter is giving an answer to the crowd - specifically about the “tongues” that they heard the disciples speaking.   Peter said that this event (Visible to the crowd by the “Speaking in Tongues” of the apostles and disciples) was and is a fulfillment of Scripture, and that that Scripture is about God's promise to pour out His Holy Spirit on all people.

Notice again verse 38and 39 of the same chapter -  what Peter says at the end of his message, to the crowd, "repent, and let every one of you be baptized into the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. For the promise is to you, and to your children, and to all or a far-off, as many as the Lord will call." The crowd had asked Peter what this "speaking in tongues" meant, and Peter in response told them that it was a promise to them from God, written in the prophets many years ago.

 But, he told them that in order to receive this promise, they must first receive Jesus, and after that was done, they could receive the promise of the Holy Spirit - which is what they initially were asking about. He went on to settle, once and for all time, who could receive the Holy Spirit – who could receive this promise from God, when he said in verse 39, "the promise is to you and to your children, and to all who are afar off, as many as the Lord our God will call." That pretty much settles it – the promise is for everyone; not only the Jewish Christians of bible times, but for you and me now, for we are – "as many as the Lord our God shall call."

Actually, we've already looked at the second time that people were filled with the Holy Spirit in the book of Acts. That was Acts chapter 8; when Philip but down to Samaria and preached Christ to them. Remember, that after they were saved and baptized into the name of Jesus, the apostles came down and laid hands on them that they might receive the Holy Spirit. Again, let me point out, they were born of the spirit when they received Jesus and became Christians, but still the apostles came down, to give them a second gift – that they might receive the Holy Spirit.

Let's start at Acts 8:17 – 19, "then they laid hands on them, and they received the Holy Spirit. And when Simon saw that through the laying on of the apostles’ hands the Holy Spirit was given, he offered them money, saying, ‘give me this power also, that anyone on who I lay hands may receive the Holy Spirit." Though it may not be apparent right away, what exactly happened when the apostles laid their hands on the people, what ever happened, Simon was able to see it, and it was so dramatic that Simon (previously Simon the sorcerer –  called ‘the great power of God” – and most likely not easily impressed) wanted to purchase this power from the disciples. Simon either saw or heard something very impressive. This will become evident later, as we look at other bible passages that clearly depict what happens when you receive the Holy Spirit, that most likely, Simon saw and heard people "speaking in tongues" or prophesying, or praising God, or all of the above.

The next time that the Holy Spirit is poured out on a group of people takes place in Acts chapter 10. Acts 10 is the account of the apostle Peter preaching Christ to the Gentiles for the very first time. At the end of Peter's sermon to the household of Cornelius, God, by a sovereign act, poured out his Holy Spirit for the first time ever on gentile believers. We read in verse 44, "while Peter was still speaking these words, the Holy Spirit fell upon all those who heard the word. And those of the circumcision who believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because the gift of the Holy Spirit had been poured out on the Gentiles also. For they heard them speak with tongues and magnify God. Then Peter answered can anyone forbid water that these should not be baptized who have received the Holy Spirit just as we have? And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord." There are several matters here that may need clearing up, in regards to whether salvation came before  or at the same time as the Holy Spirit or not, because it appears that the Holy Spirit came first – but he did not!

This is just a quick side note, but I will cover it briefly: Peter went Cornelius's house in obedience to the heavenly vision that he received on the roof of Simon the Tanner's, but even though he was commanded to go, he was not sure what would happen, nor was he told what would happen when he got there. The Gentiles who heard Peter’s message believed it, and therefore were saved, or born-again, before the gift of the Holy Spirit was poured out upon them. We know this, because as we studied earlier, the world cannot receive Him (the Holy Spirit) John 14:17. Peter did not know that these people could actually be “born again,” only that he was to go and see what they wanted. These were the first Gentiles ever to be born again, and as a “sign” to the Jewish believers - that God had accepted them – which was something that the Jewish believers did not understand as of yet,  and they were not ready to receive easily – God showed them a sign of his “approval of the Gentile believers”, by filling them with the Holy Spirit the moment after they believed.  God did this so that the Jews would know that God approved the Gentiles for salvation. This event – seemingly out of sequence, in the normal order of things – was a sign to the apostles and the Jewish Christians with them, that they needed to accept and receive their Gentile brothers in Christ.

We know this because of the words of Peter in verse 47, where he says, "can anyone forbid water that these should not be baptized, who have received the Holy Spirit just as we have? And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord." It was at the point where Peter heard the Gentiles “speaking with tongues,” that he realized the interpretation of the vision he had received at Simon the Tanner's house – the Gentiles could be saved.

That being said, the main point that I want to bring out from this passage, is that when the Holy Spirit was poured out, the disciples knew it because they heard the Gentiles, "speak with tongues and magnify God." Two of the three times now, that we have looked at the baptism of the Holy Spirit or the Holy Spirit being poured out – the second experience with the Holy Spirit, the people “spoke with tongues,” and the other time we are not sure exactly what happened, but whatever happened; it could be both seen and heard.

The next passage we will look at will be acts 19:1 – 6, "and it happened while Apollos was at Corinth, that Paul, having passed through the upper regions, came to Ephesus. And finding some disciples, he said to them, ‘did you receive the Holy Spirit when you believed?’ So they said to him ‘we have not so much as heard whether there is a Holy Spirit.’ And he said to them, ‘into what then were you baptized?’ So they said ‘into John's baptism.’ Then Paul said ‘John indeed baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying to the people that they should believe on him who would come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.’ When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. And when Paul had laid his hands on them, the Holy Spirit came upon them, and they spoke with tongues and prophesied."

Again, we notice from this passage, that after they were baptized – the implication being that they were saved or born-again – that after that, Paul laid his hands on them, and they received this second experience with the Holy Spirit. Also from this passage, we see that when they received the Holy Spirit, that they "spoke with tongues and prophesied." So, now we see for a fourth time, that when the people received the Holy Spirit that they “spoke with tongues,” magnified God, or prophesied. In the three times where we are actually told what happened – all three of those times, the people “spoke with tongues.” Other manifestations of the spirit were present – magnifying the Lord, and prophesying, but on each occasion where these two other manifestations took place, “speaking with tongues” was there also, and appears first and  in primary importance in every list.  Speaking in tongues is beginning to appear to be the single “common denominator’ in every listed occurrence of people being “filled” or “baptized” in the Holy Spirit” in the New Testament.

There is another occasion in the book of Acts where someone received being “filled” with the Holy Spirit, and that is when the apostle Paul himself received the Holy Spirit. You may remember that Paul (first named Saul) was knocked off his donkey on the way to Damascus, to imprison whatever Christians he could find there.  While on the road, he heard the voice of the Lord and saw a bright light, and he became blind for a season.

 We pick up the story again, in Acts chapter 9:17, 18, "and Ananias went his way and entered the house; and laying his hands on him he said, brother Saul, the Lord Jesus who appeared to you on the road as you came, has sent me that you may receive your site and be filled with the Holy Spirit. Immediately, there fell from his eyes something like scales, and he received his sight at once, and he arose and was baptized." Please notice that Ananias came for two reasons: that Paul may receive his sight, AND that he might be “filled with the Holy Spirit.” We can see from this text that Paul did immediately receive his sight. We should assume also, that he was “filled with the Holy Spirit,” even though the text does not say exactly what happened, or what that  “filling” may & have looked or sounded like.

However, we have Paul's own words about his Holy Spirit experience, written for us in 1 Corinthians 14:18, “I thank you God I speak in tongues more than you all.”  Paul plainly declares in that passage that he is one who “speaks in tongues.”  When would Paul have received this gift?  The most plausible and biblical answer is: when Ananias came and laid hands on him to be “filled with the Spirit.” In fact, Paul, more than any other writer in the New testament (next to Jesus speaking about it) spends more time - actually whole chapters - speaking to the Church about the our personal need of the Holy Spirit,  the gifts of the Holy Spirit, and the power and operation of the Holy Spirit in our actual church services. Paul was a “born again” “tongue talkin” preacher of the Gospel, that both believed and preached that all believers should be filled with, and operate in, the power of the Holy Spirit – and he even went as far as to say, “I wish that you all spoke with tongues…” (1 Corinthians 14:5).  And again, in verse 15, “What is the conclusion then? I will pray with the spirit, and I will also pray with the understanding.  I will sing with the spirit, and I will also sing with the understanding.”

So, we see that in all 5 cases in the book of Acts, where the Holy Spirit is poured out, or people are “filled with” or “baptized in”  the Holy Spirit, that SOMETHING that could be either visibly viewed or audibly heard took place and that others either saw or heard it when it happened. Also, we know that in 4 of the 5 cases, that those people “spoke in tongues” without a doubt, and that though the other 2 manifestations (Prophesy and glorifying God) did also  occur, only “speaking in tongues” is common thread that runs through every biblical experience of being “filled” or baptized in the Holy Spirit.

But you say, “Doesn’t Paul himself say in 1 Corinthians 12:29-30, “Are all apostles?  Are all prophets?  Are all teachers?  Are all workers of miracles?  Do all have the gifts of healings?  Do all speak with tongues?  Do all interpret?” And of course the answer is NO!  So how then can speaking in tongues be for EVERY believer then?  The answer is very simple – why don’t we cover it briefly in the next chapter…

Chapter 2 - I've Got the Holy Spirit, But I Don't Speak in Tongues - Don't Bug Me!

 Chapter 2

In John chapter 3 verse 5, Jesus said, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Do not marvel that I said to you, you must be born again." Notice from these verses that Jesus calls being “born again,” being born of the spirit. When you become a Christian – which is the same as being born again – you are born of the spirit. At the point where you become a Christian the Holy Spirit enters into your heart – enters into your life, and give you New life and a new heart. The way that you become born again, or become a Christian, which we have already discussed from Romans chapter 10:9, 10, is to believe in your heart that God raised Jesus from the dead and confess with your mouth that; Jesus is your Lord. Romans 10:10 says, that "confession is made unto salvation." The way in to being born again, is confessing Jesus as your Lord and believing it in your heart. At this point; at the point of conversion or becoming “saved” you are actually born of the spirit. So we become saved by believing in Jesus as Lord – or our personal Savior, and when we become saved, we are born of the spirit – so why then does Jesus tell his people who are both saved and born of the spirit, to “Wait in Jerusalem until they receive the promise of the Father?” SO, what is the promise of the father? For the answer to that question, we must go back to the book of Acts chapter 1 verse 8, “but you shall receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you, and you shall be witnesses unto Me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judea, and Samaria, and to the end of the earth." We can see from this verse, that the “promise of the Father” which Jesus refers to in verse four is the Holy Spirit coming upon them. But wait, I thought they had already received the Holy Spirit when Jesus breathed on them 40 says earlier? They did!

Is it possible to receive the Holy Spirit twice? Holy Spirit is a person, Jesus referred to him as "he" or “Him” on many occasions. The Holy Spirit is not sectioned into pieces so that you can receive them in parts, and at different times. However, Jesus does speak of a second experience of receiving the Holy Spirit. And, not only Jesus, but the apostle Paul  spoke about a second experience of receiving the Holy Spirit as well.

First, let's look at what happened in Jerusalem after Jesus told his disciples to wait there until they had received the “promise of the Father.” Acts chapter 2:1 – 4, "when the day of Pentecost had fully come, they were all with one accord in one place. And suddenly there came a sound from heaven, as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled the whole house where they were sitting. Then there appeared to them divided tongues as of fire, and one that upon each one of them. And they were all filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance." The Bible says they were filled with the Holy Spirit; but isn't this a second time? Yes it is. So, Jesus himself commanded two separate experiences: when he gave them the Holy Spirit the day that they were born again or became Christians, and then again, when He commanded them to wait in Jerusalem for, and receive the Holy Spirit - after they have become Christians.

As I said before, the apostle Paul also teaches this same second experience of receiving the Holy Spirit. Acts chapter 19; 1,2 read, "and it happened while Apollos was at Corinth, that Paul, having passed through the upper regions, came to Ephesus. And finding some of the disciples he said to them, did you receive the Holy Spirit when you believed? So they said to him we have not so much as heard whether there is a Holy Spirit." Notice that Paul assumed that they were believers already, but went on to ask them if they had received the Holy Spirit since that time. Paul was asking them, not if they are Christians – and Born of the Spirit - but if since they have become Christians, if they have had this second experience with the Holy Spirit.

Let's look one more place, let's go to the book of Acts chapter 8. This is the story of Philip; not Philip the apostle, but Philip the deacon, who went down the Samaria and preached Christ to the Samaritans. Notice verse 12, "but when they believed Phillip as he preached the things concerning the kingdom of God and the name of Jesus Christ, both men and women were baptized." They listen to Philip and believed his preaching about Jesus, and became Christians. This is evidenced by the fact that Philip baptized them. So from all we've learned so far, at that point (where they believed and were baptized) they were born of the spirit, for they had become Christians. If that was all that was needed, then that should have been the end of the story. But, it was not, for we read starting in verse 14 of the same chapter, "now when the apostles who were at Jerusalem heard that Samaria had received the word of God, they sent Peter and John to them who, when they had come down prayed for them, that they might receive the Holy Spirit. For as yet He had fallen upon none of them. They had only been baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. Then they laid hands on them, and they receive the Holy Spirit." This is the fourth time now from scriptures, that we see a secondary experience of people receiving the Holy Spirit AFTER they were born again. So in summary when you are born again, when you become a Christian – you are born of the spirit – but both Jesus and the apostles taught and commanded a secondary experience which is titled by many today as, "the baptism in the Holy Spirit.”

Part 1 - I've Got the Holy Spirit, But I Don't Speak in Tongues - Don't Bug Me!

“I received the Holy Spirit when I became a Christian, if I have the Holy Spirit then why do I need to receive him again?”

“Even though I received the Holy Spirit when I became a Christian; I do believe in a secondary experience, or I asked the Holy Spirit come into my life, but I don't believe that tongues needs to be part of that experience.”

“I do believe in a secondary experience of receiving the Holy Spirit into my life called the “baptism in the Holy Spirit,” and some people to receive tongues, but I don't believe that everybody needs to receive “specking in tongues,” and that many people receive other gifts of the Spirit instead of “tongues.” Tongues are good, but not everybody gets them, and not everybody needs them.”

The above three statements are common things that I hear from Christians in the body of Christ today. These statements are not all-inclusive, and I'm sure there are many more variations of people's ideas and theories, as to how the Holy Spirit is in operation in the church and his people today. While I do admit that there is some level of segmented truth in each of these three statements above, I believe it's important that we as Christians look to the Bible with sincerity and openness, to see what the Bible actually has to say about the work of the Holy Spirit in our lives.

There is been a tremendous outpouring of the Spirit, and of salvation in the last 15 years within the body of Christ, and large numbers, and masses of people have come into the kingdom of God through accepting Jesus Christ as our Lord and Savior. The Bible declares that there is more rejoicing in heaven over one soul that comes into the kingdom then over all the saved people that are already in the kingdom. I truly believe this, and my spirit rejoices exceedingly that this spirit of harvest and evangelism has spread over the body of Christ and/or the world in this past decade and that multiplied thousands even into millions are entering the kingdom of God and the body of Christ.

The “great commission” of Jesus to His disciples, found in the last chapter of the Gospel of Matthew chapter 28, verses 19 and 20 states, "Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit. Teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you, and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age." One of the things you may notice as you read this, is that Jesus said not only to go, but to teach (KJV) or make disciples of all nations. We can see from that that Jesus meant something beyond just bringing people into the kingdom, but to take them not only into the kingdom - but to teach them –  to teach them what? He goes on the next verse to say, "teaching them to observe “all things” whatsoever I have commanded you." It becomes apparent from that verse, that Jesus wants us to move into salvation, and then into the fullness of the kingdom of God; not to leave people just inside the doors of heaven, but to teach them to observe everything, or all things that Jesus taught.  That was the “great commission” – to teach them all things, not just to make “converts” – but to take those converts on into the fullness of all that Jesus taught.

While this book can in no way encompass all the things that Jesus taught, we will endeavor to focus on one main teaching that Jesus did speak about with incredible emphasis; and that is Jesus’ teaching on the Holy Spirit and his relationship to the church and the individual believer.

Many pastors and theologians teach today that the church was born on the day of Pentecost, and while I agree with that in theory, sometimes it clouds the issue about the Holy Spirit, because if the Holy Spirit was poured out, into the church just one time, on the day of Pentecost  - the day that the church was supposedly born, then we only have one experience and that is – being born again -  entering the church and receiving the Holy Spirit at that same moment, just like they did on the day of Pentecost.  Let's take a closer look at that.

How does one become a Christian and enter the "church?" In Matthew chapter 16:13 - 18, Jesus talking to his disciples, he says "who do men say that I, the Son of Man am? So they said, ‘some say John the Baptist, some Elijah, and others Jeremiah or one of the prophets.’ He said to them, ‘but who do you say that I am?’ Simon Peter answered and said, ‘you are the Christ, the son of the living God.’ Jesus answered and said to him, ‘blessed are you, Simon bar-Jonah, for flesh and blood has not revealed this to you, but my Father who is in heaven. And I also say to you that you are Peter and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of Hades shall not prevail against it." Now without going completely into this, and tearing it completely down, let us focus simply what Jesus said to Peter; After Peter said “you are the Christ the son of the living God;” Jesus said to Peter, “ you are Peter and upon this rock I will build my church.” There are many today that believe that Peter himself was the rock upon which Jesus was going to build his church, however, when reading this in the original Greek, it becomes very plain that this is not actually what Jesus was saying at all. The name Peter comes from the Greek word “Petros” – which means small stone. The word for “rock” in this same passage comes from the Greek word “Petra” which means large-stone. If we read it that way, then Jesus answer to Peter actually reads like this, "and Peter you are a small stone, but upon this large rock, I will build my church." Now, if Peter is the small stone, then what is the large rock that Jesus is building his church on? The large rock that Jesus is building his church upon is the rock of Peter's confession in the previous verse that “Jesus is the Christ the son of the living God.”

That may seem like a lot of splitting of hairs, but it becomes an important first foundation to understanding how the church is built, who the church is, and how you enter the church or the body of Christ. As we stated above, entering the body of Christ or the church happens when someone realizes who Jesus is and confesses him as Savior and Lord, the Son of the living God. Just to be sure that that is the truth, let's go further into the New Testament to the book of Romans chapter 10. Starting at Romans chapter 10 verse 9, we read, "that if you will confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God hath raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation." And again in verse 13, "for whoever calls on the name of the Lord shall be saved." Notice again, that even in the book of Romans, that it is the “confession of Jesus as Lord,” and believing it in your heart that causes a man or woman to be born again oe “saved.” Isn't that exactly the same as thing that Jesus said to Peter in Matthew chapter 16:18?

Just to be sure, let's go to the book of Acts chapter 16. Acts chapter 16 is about the adventures of Paul and Silas in the town of Philippi, and how they were thrown into jail for preaching the gospel there, and how subsequently when they sang praises to God at midnight, the prison doors were open but they did not run away. Instead, they went to the home of the Philippian jailor. After spending time with him and his family, he asked them directly in verse 30, "Sirs, what must I do to be saved?" Their direct response in verse 31 was, "believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved, you and your household." So we see one more time, that simply to believe on the name of Jesus Christ, and to “confess him as Lord,” is what causes someone to become “born again,”  to become a Christian or to become part of the church -  the body of Christ.  All of these terms mean basically the same thing, and describe “becoming a Christian.”

We have taken the time to lay this foundation, so that we can clearly distinguish what it means to become a Christian, so that we can clearly distinguish when the church could have possibly been started or come into existence, so that it may become clear that the church was NOT necessarily born on the day of Pentecost, but that it came into being at the resurrection of Jesus. One quick side note, the reason I say that the resurrection of Jesus, as opposed to the moment when someone might “realize” that Jesus was the Christ (Like Peter did – or others at that time may have), is that before Jesus paid the price for our sins with his blood, no one could be “born again” or become a Christian. This is because even though someone of those “pre – cross” days might recognized Jesus as the Messiah or the Christ, the price had not yet been paid, and the way to salvation through Jesus Christ was not yet open. After the resurrection, the price for salvation had been paid; the way to God was opened through Jesus Christ, and anyone who believed in him and received him as Lord could be born again.

In the gospel of John chapter 20, verse 17, Jesus speaks to Mary Magdalena, as she sees him outside the empty tomb and says, "do not cling to me, for I have not yet ascended to my Father; but go to my brethren and say to them; I am ascending to my Father and your Father, and to my God and your God." This was the first time Jesus had ever spoken any words like this to his disciples. He plainly declared to Mary that his Father was now her Father, and that his God, was now her God.  And, he called his disciples “brothers.” Just a few verses later, on the very same day Jesus appears to his disciples in verses 19 - 23. In verse 21, Jesus says to them, "peace to you: as the Father has sent me, I also send you." Verse 22 says, "and when he had said this, he breathed on them and said unto them, ‘Receive the Holy Spirit." So the disciples received the Holy Spirit on the day that Jesus was resurrected from the dead; were they born again that day?  Yes! Did the “church” begin that day? Yes!

 The gospel of John also tells us in chapter 14 verse 17, that the “world” – or the unborn again person – cannot receive the Holy Spirit. John 14:16, 17, "and I will pray the Father, and he will give you another Helper, that he may abide with you for ever - even the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him; but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you." Again, we can see from these verses, that the world cannot receive the Spirit of truth – the Holy Spirit. We also see, that up to this point, the Holy Spirit had been with the disciples, but Jesus promise to them was that from now on, he would be in them.

In John chapter 20, when Jesus appeared to his disciples, He commissioned them, and then breathed on them and said, “Receive  the Holy Spirit.”  That, my friends was the moment that the church was actually born! Why is it important that this be the time that the Church was born and not the Day of Pentecost? Because, if the church was born on the day that Christ was resurrected, and the disciples were filled with the Holy Spirit for the first time, the day that Jesus came out of the tomb, then, why 40 days later does Jesus tell his disciples in the book of Acts chapter 1 verse 4, "and, being assembled together with them, commanded them that they should not depart from Jerusalem, but wait for the promise of the Father, which he said, you have heard of me. For John truly baptized with water; but you shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit not many days hence."

But I thought that they had already received the Holy Spirit? Is it possible that Jesus meant a secondary experience in the Holy Spirit? Had they not been born-again the day that Jesus appeared to them after coming out of the tomb? Had they not received the Holy Spirit when he said to them directly, “receive ye the Holy Spirit" and breathed on them? These are all important questions, questions we need answers to, that we might rightly understand the ministry of the Holy Spirit in our lives today, and that we might receive the fullness of everything that God wants for us as his children in Christ Jesus.

The Church Today - Stronger or Weaker? Are We Becoming "Word Poor?"

It is a very sad thing indeed to me... that many ministers today know so little of the actual Word of God (Their biz??)  and that instead of chapter and verse, chapter and verse, for what they do - they conduct their ministries by "Leadership styles, " "traditions," "Personality based" that we have a "business model" instead of a New testament biblical model.

If you ask for chapter and verse for a specific policy or procedure - many just simply get upset and shut down...because in their mind - all they want is the "good of the Church" They say they are only interested in “the truth,” but if you present them with chapter and verse...they say "that's not the way we do it here" ..is that "being interested in the truth" or being SELF deceived???

No, no no, I'm not talking about anyone of my FB friends, I talked briefly today to the head of counseling for a mega church here in town, and she was just frustrated at the amount of people she works with these days, who in the name of God "Give themselves permission to be happy" even when they have to re-write the Bible to pull it off.... Sadly - it is listed as the "chief sign" of the last days...

Strangely - that same sign in the people is also listed as the chief issue with Church LEADERS in the end of times...."Do you seek the Truth in all that you do OR do you seek someone to ratify your version of the truth" Jesus said that men will not come to the light because their deeds were evil (John 3:19) - that is true both inside and out of the church....Some people just want to live in the Matrix even though they know it's not real....

Scary thought - "whatever you have spoken in the secret places will be shouted from the housetops" Jesus said that!  When will this happen? During the millennium - no way baby! (And I don't believe he just meant the big societal sins...?)

"...yet once more I shake not only the earth, but also heaven' Now this "Yet once more" indicates the [Removal] of those things which are being shaken, as of things that are made, that the things which cannot be shaken may remain. Therefore since we are receiving a kingdom which CANNOT be shaken...." (Hebrews 12:26-29) THIS IS A NEW TESTAMENT prophecy which MUST be fulfilled...

The "dross, the leaven, and the lies” must leave the Church – it’s God's plan, not mine...."I feel a whole lot of shakin' goin on!”

Both Jesus and Deuteronomy said/say, “Man does not “live” by bread alone, but by EVERY Word of God" You ability to have "life" "(Translated accurately as abundant life) is based "SOLEY" on your level of Truth:  little truth =little life, more truth = more life, etc...  If we acknowledge this is true (Refer to Peter 1:2, John 8:31, 32, Matthew 11:29). Then, why are we, the body of Christ not “clawing after” all the truth we can get? The Scripture above stated that; "that the “life” that is promised to us in Christ requires every Word of God in order to be as full of life as God desires His “LIFE” to be for us.truth= more life, etc... if we acknowledge this is true (2 Peter 1:2, John 8:31, 32, Matt 11:29)  Then, why are we (the body of Christ) not “clawing after” all the truth we can get? The Scripture above stated that; "that the “life” that is promised to us in Christ requires every Word of God in order to be as full of life as God desires His “LIFE” to be for us.

Even the world knows this to be true - only the Christian is so “dull” to miss this truth... ie: the more you know about money - how it grows, how it is made, how it is shielded, etc... the more you can usually have... more specific knowledge (in any area) puts one in the way of more abundance in that field... Only the Christian "blinded” by their “blind guides,” more concerned with their own personal kingdom building or status among their peers, or ignorantly lost inside their own traditions, handed down by their elders…) We seem continually blind to the truth inside the very BOOK that brings life, and the book that is the sum total of the very “essence” of his Savior – Jesus is the Word made flesh (we ignore the Word, but say we want him???) Jesus also said to the rich man and to us, "if they will not hear Moses (the Word) then they will not hear me..." "Can you hear me now?"

Your growth in life (Both naturally and spiritually) is solely dependant on and EXACTLY PORPORTIONAL to you own personal ability to assimilate TRUTH - the faster you assimilate it = the faster you grow. AND in spiritual matters (Unlike the world system) only YOU determine how fast you grow, because you and YOU ALONE determine how much truth you are willing to accept at any time...

Are you a “short bus” believer because you have chosen to be one? Or, did you make a bad choice and go to church with a “short bus” pastor... Remember, he/she can only teach you what he has allowed into his or her life??? One way, you may have had an excuse – up till now, but now – you are without excuse – if you have the book [Bible] and you go to a “short bus” church – you are without excuse before Jesus – Jesus will simply ask you if you can read – the choice is now yours...